Is ATS going soft? Lost the plot?

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Postby ryguy » Tue Feb 05, 2008 3:35 pm

Springer wrote:Nope, NOT Meier (PLEASE!), NOT anyone associated with slurpo (Ry I am aghast!) and not Clifford Stone.

Our Nube is someone who has actually been educated in the sciences and is, IMHO, a good egg and a REAL researcher.

Springer...


Unfortunately...that's a description of at least two of the Slurpo scammers. :)

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Postby Chorlton » Tue Feb 05, 2008 5:30 pm

Springer wrote:Our Nube is someone who has actually been educated in the sciences and is, IMHO, a good egg and a REAL researcher.

Springer...

Firstly, IYHO John Lear was a 'good egg'

Secondly, Please define
'REAL researcher'

I consider myself a REAL researcher and when Im dead all of my research will be sent to various 'agencies' to either use to further their research or dismiss as they wish. That I dont make outlandish claims, or like you, try to cash in on it makes me no less a REAL researcher
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Postby IgnoreTheFacts » Tue Feb 05, 2008 6:01 pm

Now, there's nothing wrong with trying to "cash in" on research...of any type. Too many people are of the mindset that "profit" is a bad word.

If it were not for people cashing in on research, we would not have the light bulb, television, modern medicine, and all the fancy stuff we love to spend our hard earned cash on.

Chort, think of it like this, someone, somewhere is spending their time and money researching the perfect guitar amplifier...think they are going to give that away for free when they get it (even though it is a subjective goal, lol)
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Postby ryguy » Tue Feb 05, 2008 6:09 pm

IgnoreTheFacts wrote:Now, there's nothing wrong with trying to "cash in" on research...of any type. Too many people are of the mindset that "profit" is a bad word.

If it were not for people cashing in on research, we would not have the light bulb, television, modern medicine, and all the fancy stuff we love to spend our hard earned cash on.


Absolutely - good old American innovation (wow...that was ethnocentric of me, lol...).

The problems start when the research is a pipe-dream or fraudulent, and in the end there is not, nor will there ever be, any such end product - in effect, zero return on investment.

However - your point is a good one, and it's the dream that the investors chase like the gold rush, hoping to have some ownership of the "next big thing"...often to their financial demise.

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Postby Chorlton » Tue Feb 05, 2008 6:13 pm

IgnoreTheFacts wrote:Now, there's nothing wrong with trying to "cash in" on research...of any type. Too many people are of the mindset that "profit" is a bad word.

If it were not for people cashing in on research, we would not have the light bulb, television, modern medicine, and all the fancy stuff we love to spend our hard earned cash on.

Chort, think of it like this, someone, somewhere is spending their time and money researching the perfect guitar amplifier...think they are going to give that away for free when they get it (even though it is a subjective goal, lol)


I should have said "cashing in on something that they have no proof for, nor are, in the foreseeable future likey to have empirical evidence for"
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Postby Access Denied » Thu Feb 07, 2008 5:36 am

yfxxx wrote:Does this mean that this particular form of advertising will cease?? :shock:

I doubt it… seems the only way anyone can make a substantial living in this field is by promoting hoaxers and charlatans. I don’t think ATS can afford to be completely out of the LMH/C2C loop or whatever it was… OM or similar will surely snap up the “market share” for that sort of thing. Now whether or not Lear has finally outlived his usefulness remains to be seen… interestingly the “dreaded” woo woo (© 2007 ITF) revolt used to justify his existence [i.e. Lear as defacto woo woo poster child] has yet to materialize.

Regardless, one can only hope that the ATS membership at large has finally grown as weary of the Lear/Zorgon Inane Sockpuppet Spam Army (LZISSA) as we did…

yfxxx wrote:Anyway, I wonder what's the story behind this "retirement" ;).

Lear had Mark by the balls and he squeezed them just a little too tight this time? Nah...

[my guess is in addition to whatever little lover’s quarrel he supposedly had with Mark, Lear wasn’t satisfied with his nonexistent “cut” and nor is Sleeper] :lol:


Heh heh, who would have thought Lear of all people would catch Mark and Bill in not one, but two lies… oh the irony. Naturally the thread was closed before too many folks caught on…

[e.g. if his supposed rival CM Jeff had also been post banned since 1/28 as claimed why was he able to post after that while Lear wasn’t?]

Springer wrote:ITF, if you have unread (by you) u2us in your in box that *appear* to have been read it's because they were sent to multiple members and once read by one "un bolded" for all.

As ITF already pointed out… do we look that stupid? Besides having experienced the same thing numerous times with PMs (presumably) sent only to me, I recall while I was still a fine upstanding member of ATS that U2Us I *know* were sent to multiple members were still marked unread days or weeks later… somehow I don’t think that meant nobody else had read those messages yet either. :wink:

Isn't there a disclaimer in the U2U section stating management reserves the right to read U2Us or has that now been removed?

[nobody reads the fine print anyway] :roll:

Springer wrote:I assure you we have much better things to spend our time on than snooping in your u2u in box.

I doubt it… either that or you have no clue what your staff is doing behind your back and who all has the ability to hack into ATS accounts. ;)

[that’s all I’m going to say about that “my friend” seeing how you saw it fit to burn your bridges with me and others over Lear]

caleban wrote:He [Stone] actually has contributed something, which should place him in some form of ATS esteem.

BWAHAHAHA… you call Stone profiting from FOIA documents he copied from somebody else a “contribution”??? I call that a mildly successful snake-oil salesman.

[kindred spirits you and he?]

Springer wrote:Our Nube is someone who has actually been educated in the sciences and is, IMHO, a good egg and a REAL researcher.

Is this the guy?

DogHead Speaks (?)
http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread332270/pg1

[although I applaud his apparent willingness to put his money where his mouth is I wouldn’t be surprised to find out he too has a mutually exclusive agenda]

The "Conspriacy Master" thing stinks IMO… there are no viable credentials in CT… except possibly how much money you’ve earned by telling people what they want to hear. The SME (subject matter expert) thing is a joke too… take Gazrok for example. He might as well change his name to Stanton Friedman… ignoring contrary evidence makes one an expert in UFOlogy?

Wait never mind, I think I just answered my own question… 8)

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Postby caleban » Thu Feb 07, 2008 6:46 am

you call Stone profiting from FOIA documents he copied from somebody else a
“contribution”??? I call that a mildly successful snake-oil salesman.


Have you looked at all these documents? Where he got them all can't be from
the same person, unless that person is stupid enough to still allow his stuff to
be copied as recently as 2004. How do you know Stone has profited from this?

kindred spirits you and he?


In a strange way, perhaps. He is ex-military. He has a way of showing his
true personality in his posts. He is a nice guy, that is clear. Does that
make him credible ? No. But it makes him read-able, unlike JL who just
gives me knee jerks.

Is this the guy? DogHead


I do like your guess better than mine. If I had a "big head"
I might even suspect his user ID was inspired by my current avatar.

ignoring contrary evidence makes one an expert in UFOlogy?


Not enough for that but sufficient to keep your base membership in good standing.
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Postby Access Denied » Thu Feb 07, 2008 8:02 am

caleban wrote:Have you looked at all these documents?

No… nor I do feel any need to.

caleban wrote:Where he got them all can't be from the same person, unless that person is stupid enough to still allow his stuff to be copied as recently as 2004.

Did I say he got them ALL from the same person?

caleban wrote:How do you know Stone has profited from this?

You mean besides being employed by the Roswell Museum? I’m going by this…

We need member volunteers to review FOIA documents
http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread315349/pg1

SkepticOverlord wrote:Also, there is "warm and fuzzy" side to our effort here... a significant portion of the ad revenue generated by the discussion and views surrounding these documents will be sent to Mr. Stone and his family. Finally, we get to thank him in the best way possible for his life's hard work -- the awareness he desires and the financial compensation he deserves.

I don’t know about you but I don’t get all “warm and fuzzy” about somebody who has made a bunch of unsubstantiated and demonstratably false claims profiting from it… and I find it quite humorous many are willing to help him make even more for free.

caleban wrote:He is a nice guy, that is clear. Does that make him credible ? No. But it makes him read-able, unlike JL who just gives me knee jerks.

To each his own however I find his ending every post with "God Bless" equally as insipid as John Lear ending his with "Thanks for the post" :)
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Postby IgnoreTheFacts » Thu Feb 07, 2008 10:09 am

Anyone one hear think it's funny how many around these parts were banned for sparing with ATS's golden boy Lear and now see this happening?

Those of you that were banned should be reconsidered now that perhaps Springer and the boys see Lear's true colors with a little more clarity. Fat chance though, there is no room for folks that display common sense, reason and logic. Nothing you guys did in your posts was bad at all, and I see posts from members EVERYDAY in MULTIPLE sections that do the same thing and WORSE, however for some reason management leaves them alone (and they are equally divided between skeptics and nutjobs...go figure)
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Postby Chorlton » Thu Feb 07, 2008 1:24 pm

IgnoreTheFacts wrote:Anyone one hear think it's funny how many around these parts were banned for sparing with ATS's golden boy Lear and now see this happening?

Those of you that were banned should be reconsidered now that perhaps Springer and the boys see Lear's true colors with a little more clarity. Fat chance though, there is no room for folks that display common sense, reason and logic. Nothing you guys did in your posts was bad at all, and I see posts from members EVERYDAY in MULTIPLE sections that do the same thing and WORSE, however for some reason management leaves them alone (and they are equally divided between skeptics and nutjobs...go figure)


I cant see Herr Grupenfuhrer Springer ever admitting he was wrong
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Postby ryguy » Thu Feb 07, 2008 3:36 pm

Access Denied wrote:DogHead Speaks (?)
http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread332270/pg1


....intriguing...

The principals of the businesses are my primary concern. Some have military, financial or security backgrounds themselves and are not to be harmed in any way by my fringe interests, especially since I arrived initially as "rich idiot" as one of them called me rather than "trusted ally".


I love it....this is great stuff.

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Postby Chorlton » Thu Feb 07, 2008 4:57 pm

So, they get rid of one teller of Fairytales and immediately employ another ?
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Postby Springer » Fri Feb 08, 2008 7:11 pm

IgnoreTheFacts wrote: Fat chance though, there is no room for folks that display common sense, reason and logic.


hrmmm that's odd, I see you, IgnoreTheFacts, are still a member and you posted just the other day... What are you trying to say? :lol:

IgnoreTheFacts wrote: Nothing you guys did in your posts was bad at all,


Bollocks. They were asked several times to focus on the TOPICS not the poster, they were asked several times to abide the civility rules. Heck, one of them was let back on several times and every time, failed to control himself within the bounds of the TAC. The sheer lack of understanding WRT why you guys were banned is astounding.

NOBODY has replaced JL yet, and NONE of your guesses are correct. I have no clue who this Doghead person is.

JL showed his true colors and he is gone now, does that mean I was wrong about him? I guess it does doesn't it? No big deal to admit when one is wrong, it's called being human. But to say I was wrong for allowing him a place to express his wild theories on a website devoted to theories (wild and otherwise) is just silly.

I am more hurt by his actions on a personal level (I really thought we were friends) than I am concerned about whether or not he belonged on ATS. Of course he belonged on ATS, wild speculation is part of what ATS is and it's what causes the imagination to look beyond the known facts.

I know most of you guys feel he was presenting his speculation as fact, well you are in the minority there, the guy had disclaimers in his signature FFS that one of you swore he would never put up. What more can a person do to make sure everyone knows what he is posting is his opinion, and it could very well be totally wrong, than make that very statement beneath each and every post they make?!

I know most of you hated his style and that's your right, but as I've said a million times, all you had to do was IGNORE him. You chose, instead, to disregard the requests of the owner of the house you were a guest in and acted like schoolyard bullies. :lol:

In any case we've moved on, the "JL era" at ATS has come to an end and a new "era" shall begin, it's the nature of the business.

Springer...
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Postby Chorlton » Fri Feb 08, 2008 7:43 pm

Springer burped:
"I know most of you hated his style and that's your right, but as I've said a million times, all you had to do was IGNORE him. "

But you booted me because you and a few other milksops hated my style??.
Why didnt you and the others just ignore me? as there were far more that liked my style than f---- who didnt?.
Even you stated you didnt disagree with what I was saying but rather my way of saying it, which wasnt my fault but the fault of the braindeads in nowheresville USA, who are married to their sister.

BTW Its nice to see that wonderfull expletive 'Bollocks' crossing the pond.
I withdraw what I said about you Yanks not learning things. (well some things anyway)
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Postby ryguy » Fri Feb 08, 2008 8:05 pm

Chorlton wrote:....which wasnt my fault but the fault of the braindeads in nowheresville USA, who are married to their sister.


Hey. For your information I grew up in nowheresville. There were plenty of brains. Pig's brain on toast every saturday morning with a side serving of taters and baked beans.

And for your further information they did not marry their sisters up there. They married their first cousins. So there.

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