ATS Banning Practices?

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Re: ATS Banning Practices? Very Questionable

Postby GigaShadow » Thu Oct 02, 2008 8:29 pm

When you get on the ats sheet database list, you have problems. They plant a cgi bug on your profile. Its located where your points acumulate. I know, because I found & installed software that showed me the cgi bug. The bug identifier showed me & many others have a cgi tracking bug on there profiles as well.

Septic overload responded to my question about this tracking bug by accusing me of turning of ads rather than answer the question I posted.

There's something very evil going on there.
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Reply

Postby Jack'sDead » Fri Oct 03, 2008 1:03 am

Welcome back Jack.


Thanks. I've actually kept popping in and out here, but have maintained a low profile here so as not to agitate my problems over at ATS further. Seems that they don't like their members going over to other boards.

No offense but in your opinion would it be safe to say you may have some issues with people not agreeing with you?


While I never gained an official "fighter" tag over there, I surely do not shy from a good debate. And yes, there were many that I engaged in there.

The reason I ask is because I’ve noticed some people seem to get away with it while others don’t. In fact I’ve seen some of the most profile offenders promoted to “Conspiracy Master”. Strange… it’s like anything goes when it comes to “out there” stuff but when things start to get “real” it gets ugly quick. In other words seems it’s cool to be “ignorant” if you’re doing it on purpose to provoke a reaction.


Yes, being "real" seems to have offended one mod in particular, but seems to have been an ongoing problem that I feel was at the root of my last banning as well. The truth hurts sometimes, and what I have to say can be harsh sometimes as well. But there is a lot of subject matter discussed that was never meant to be sugar-coated.

For example... There was a thread about a kid who jumped to his death in a suicide. Off a building I think it was. Anyway, there were people on the ground goading him to do it. A bunch of people jumped into the thread arguing that those people should have been arrested and charged as an accessory or somesuch. I proceeded to jump into the fray with the phrase "go ahead and jump." A bit harsh perhaps, but cut right to the heart of my opinion. I went on to explain that I actually did feel for their loss in regards to the family and friends left behind, but at the same time the final responsibility rests with the person who decided to kill themself. Furthermore, I am a huge lover of freedom and that includes free speech and assembly, even if one happens to be an insensitive moron that would actually goad a jumper.

A mod censored the post.

Anyway, it would be helpful if you posted a link to the thread(s) in question so we can see the context in which things started going downhill for you again.


If you go to my ex-profile (jackinthebox), you can click where it says "posts" to read all of my most recent posts in order.

Also, just curious but any chance you have one or more sock puppets?


I'm assuming "sock puppets" is about the same as multiple accounts. The answer is no. To verify that I had been banned the last time I had a co-worker open an account so that I could have a peek back into ATS land, but I never went around "talking to myself" or anything like that.

EDIT to add: My problems started after I authored a thread that I had hoped would be accepted as a "premium" submission, so that I would be payed for it. They ignored my repeated requests as to their decision, and finally the entire "ATS Premium" initiative was dropped from internal promotion. The thread was titled "Illegitimate Federal Government and the Rule of Martial Law in the United States" http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread364194/pg1
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Re: ATS Banning Practices? Very Questionable

Postby Access Denied » Sat Oct 04, 2008 6:38 pm

GigaShadow wrote:When you get on the ats sheet database list, you have problems. They plant a cgi bug on your profile. Its located where your points acumulate. I know, because I found & installed software that showed me the cgi bug. The bug identifier showed me & many others have a cgi tracking bug on there profiles as well.

Interesting, what software did you use and do you have any screen/code captures?

GigaShadow wrote:Septic overload responded to my question about this tracking bug by accusing me of turning of ads rather than answer the question I posted.

Linky?

[PM me if you prefer]

GigaShadow wrote:There's something very evil going on there.

Of THAT I have no doubt… :)
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Re: Reply

Postby Access Denied » Sat Oct 04, 2008 7:39 pm

Jack'sDead wrote:Thanks. I've actually kept popping in and out here, but have maintained a low profile here so as not to agitate my problems over at ATS further. Seems that they don't like their members going over to other boards.

That didn’t bother you?

Jack'sDead wrote:While I never gained an official "fighter" tag over there, I surely do not shy from a good debate. And yes, there were many that I engaged in there.

Not really the answer I was looking for.

Jack'sDead wrote:Furthermore, I am a huge lover of freedom and that includes free speech and assembly, even if one happens to be an insensitive moron that would actually goad a jumper.

Now that’s more like the answer I was looking for. :)

Jack'sDead wrote:A mod censored the post.

Well, there’s a difference between the principles of freedom of speech and freedom of expression… neither of which ATS seems to uphold with any kind of consistency.

Jack'sDead wrote:If you go to my ex-profile (jackinthebox), you can click where it says "posts" to read all of my most recent posts in order.

I’m currently banned there and even though Mark (Springer) said I was welcome back shortly after we launched the ATS Watch forum here, I refuse to go back until things change… I also object in principle to the use of sock puppets so there’s no way for me to check your profile.

Jack'sDead wrote:I'm assuming "sock puppets" is about the same as multiple accounts. The answer is no. To verify that I had been banned the last time I had a co-worker open an account so that I could have a peek back into ATS land, but I never went around "talking to myself" or anything like that.

Interesting, the reason I ask is because I suspect Bill has stepped up efforts to try and detect the use of sock puppets by “undesirables”. I can see how that code might have caused you some problems in that situation.

Jack'sDead wrote:EDIT to add: My problems started after I authored a thread that I had hoped would be accepted as a "premium" submission, so that I would be payed for it. They ignored my repeated requests as to their decision, and finally the entire "ATS Premium" initiative was dropped from internal promotion.

Not surprised… I don’t think they thought that one through very well. I think they were trying to attract people with some “name recognition”… why pay for what they already get for free? ;)

Jack'sDead wrote:The thread was titled "Illegitimate Federal Government and the Rule of Martial Law in the United States"

Yes, I read through that during your last pass through here. Seems to fit in with a lot of the fear generated by the recent “bail out”. You’re welcome to discuss that here if you want but beware… we have a number of very sharp folks here with a wide variety of opinions on such matters. :)
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Re: ATS Banning Practices? Very Questionable

Postby GigaShadow » Sat Oct 04, 2008 8:42 pm

Access Denied wrote: Interesting, what software did you use and do you have any screen/code captures?

GigaShadow wrote:There's something very evil going on there.

Of THAT I have no doubt… :)


I posted screen shots on ATS, but since leaving, I have taken all my images offline and off there site. The software was zonealarm pro.

Look up ats post by peepers.

I will not under any circumstance return view ats, period. I firmly beleive they are tied in with helliburton/KBR datamining ats for combatants.
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Re: ATS Banning Practices? Very Questionable

Postby mojo » Sun Oct 05, 2008 4:12 am

GigaShadow wrote:I will not under any circumstance return view ats, period. I firmly beleive they are tied in with helliburton/KBR datamining ats for combatants.


there's a good chance you are the subject of datamining if you visit any site on the internet that has any connections with In-Q-Tel or Accel Partners and maybe even TRUSTe now (imho).
they've snuck in the backdoor very nicely, though i think it's the marketers atm who are doing all the leg work.

can't remember the name of the guy, i'll see if i can find it, but he figures the best way to confuse the dataminers is by putting absolutely all his personal information in plain view, but he puts out so much stuff, not all of it relevant or correct that it actually does them more harm than good....hahahaha...confusion reigns.
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Re: Reply

Postby Jack'sDead » Sun Oct 05, 2008 8:04 pm

Access Denied wrote:Yes, I read through that during your last pass through here. Seems to fit in with a lot of the fear generated by the recent “bail out”. You’re welcome to discuss that here if you want but beware… we have a number of very sharp folks here with a wide variety of opinions on such matters. :)


I had a lot of material over there that I think I will be sharing here soon. I haven't received a response to my email, and frankly I'm not holding my breath at this point. Unless I get an apology and an explanation, I don't think that ATS is the place for me any longer. And I think that they would instead try to force me to grovel and beg, which to that I would say, "they ain't all that."

That didn’t bother you?


Well, to some extent. But I sort of gave the benefit of the doubt. I can understand that they don't want their business running off to the competition. On the other hand, if they were really "all that," then why should they really be concerned. Especially to the point that they are.

What irritated me the most was when they failed to use their own rule against posting from other message boards in a clearly biased manner. Someone stole my entire piece, posted it elsewhere, and bombarded me with posts from other boards to support his position. They did nothing. Which really made no sense to me, as the discussion wound up being carried out on another website once it was allowed to be derailed there at ATS. I really think it was just a hot potato they were trying to put on the back burner. I was even asked to do radio interviews on the piece, but suddenly I got no responses from them either.
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Most recent censorship

Postby Jack'sDead » Mon Oct 06, 2008 1:16 am

A post in this thread was deleted for "manners and decorum" after I called out the mod who was stalking me...

http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread373062/pg8

The mod who deleted it said he had just finished reading my "complaint" and had passed it "up to the owners." What perfect timing. This post was removed, literally in seconds. A bit ironic that I even included a "gee I wonder how long it will take for this to get deleted."

Got nicked in this thread for replying directly to another member that "knives and ropes" is not what made the man a criminal (as I may or may not have used them as props in my own sex-life for example,) but that the B&E was the more serious issue...

http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread396393/pg4

Serious "snip" here, as my comment had been directly on topic and went to the core of the issue being discussed...

http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread396449/pg1

And in this thread I basically got railroaded entirely out of the discussion...

http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread394836/pg2
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Re: ATS Banning Practices?

Postby Bibliophile » Thu Oct 09, 2008 3:51 pm

If you think ATS is bad, you should surf on into Project Avalon. What a joke. They beat ATS all to hell. They kneejerk ban posters just for questioning admin/mod deletions/bannings.

I deliberately provoked my banning over there, but others did not. They have taken forum Nazism to a whole new level. Makes ATS look like Romper Room.
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Re: ATS Banning Practices?

Postby ryguy » Thu Oct 09, 2008 4:36 pm

lol...I can't believe you even bothered. The place is run by Bill Ryan - what do you expect? Appropriate "decorum" over there is making sure you don't ask the important questions, and just allow con-artists to spout their stories to draw in marks.

What con-artists...and what marks?

A perfect example is Rick Doty using Bob Collins to sell top secret/confidential information/documents about these sort of topics to a wealthy believer. A higher level example is scientists and researchers milking private investors of thousands of dollars worth of "funding" for nutty science (they always point to the fact that "cutting-edge" science throughout history has always been ridiculed). Search the net for "free energy" as one simple example. "UFO Propulsion" is another.

The likes of the Avalon forum and Project Camelot only serve as a platform for these con-artists to draw in potential victims over a wider audience. If you go in and try to use reason, you are being counter-productive to the ultimate goal. It's pretty dispicable, to be frank.

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Re: ATS Banning Practices?

Postby Bibliophile » Thu Oct 09, 2008 5:15 pm

I went in for a look around. I am like a cat that way. It was interesting for a while, but their admin dork blew the dynamic.

One of the members posted something interesting this morning that I followed up on. Cut too close to the bone, I guess. The thread was deleted and I was banned in record time.

Some people are shameless.
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Re: ATS Banning Practices?

Postby Jack'sDead » Mon Oct 13, 2008 10:26 pm

Well, after two weeks now, I have gotten no response whatsoever from ATS. I have sent email via the "contact us" link, and directly to Bill. I suppose that they somehow think that they are "denying ignorance," but ignoring my concerns here seems to be the height of hypocrisy. They are "above the petty concerns" of their most active members it seems. At the very least, they could have stepped up to the plate and stated clearly that I was no longer welcome there, and more importantly, why.

Is my case yet another supposed example of some sort of "personality conflict" where I just don't quite fit into their "ethical standard?" I think that ethics would dictate at least a minimal response if that were indeed the case.

Or is there something more sinister at work here? That I struck a chord somewhere, that undermined an agenda that is to remain hidden, and therefore the real reasons for my banning cannot be revealed? In their silence, they can take advantage of ignorance, the very ignorance which they proclaim to "deny." Deny indeed, "Gee, sorry, your emails got lost due to a technical error," might be there response then, if they are finally backed into a corner in which they are forced to address my case. But if they are forced to explain why I was banned, the BS will stink enough to reveal their hand.

I laughed at the idea that there was something deeper and more sinister happening at ATS. Even when I found this board I remained highly skeptical. With a site as large as theirs, they were bound to make some enemies no matter what they did, I figured. And that the disgruntled would always "whine" about unfair treatment. And after my first banning, even though I posted here, I took great care to reserve judgement. But now the truth is becoming clearer. There is indeed something more sinister afoot. I must have spent thousands of hours over there in the past year. Now I will be dedicating that time to uncovering the reality of what ATS is. Because it certainly seems clear enough at this point that they are not what they claim to be, and I will be sharing that point in every bookstore I walk into with their new book hitting shelves. And in every forum in which ATS is discussed. Fight's on motherfiretruckers! :twisted:
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Re: ATS Banning Practices?

Postby ryguy » Tue Oct 14, 2008 2:10 pm

Jack'sDead wrote:Now I will be dedicating that time to uncovering the reality of what ATS is. Because it certainly seems clear enough at this point that they are not what they claim to be, and I will be sharing that point in every bookstore I walk into with their new book hitting shelves. And in every forum in which ATS is discussed. Fight's on motherfiretruckers! :twisted:


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Re: ATS Banning Practices?

Postby torbjon » Tue Oct 14, 2008 4:58 pm

And yet another in a long stream of identical, and yet somehow "isolated" events leading up to a quality ATS member getting banned. I'm sorry you had to go through all of that, Jack.

Quick question: Did the notes you sent to them via their Official "Contact Us" button get you an auto responder stating that your message had been sent to the 'powers that be' and that someone would be replying to you within 48 hours?

Thanks.
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Re: ATS Banning Practices?

Postby Jack'sDead » Tue Oct 14, 2008 8:22 pm

torbjon wrote:Did the notes you sent to them via their Official "Contact Us" button get you an auto responder stating that your message had been sent to the 'powers that be' and that someone would be replying to you within 48 hours?


They did indeed state that I would get a response within 48 hours. No reply from them, and no reply to my direct emails to SO. Very un-professional. [-X
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