OK, I haven't yet read this whole thread, just the first post by iskander, and the last one by Shawnna. The statement by Shawnna of "no hard facts" is the most interesting one. Maybe I can give some bits of information myself.
First of all, let me introduce myself. I am the same guy who started the following thread. I believe you will find it a very interesting read.
Now that you have some impression of what I have done on ATS (an unforgivable crime that was not punished), I can continue where the story ended on ATS.
This post (which will be read by ATS owners, and the people behind them) is the third time I expect to be banned from ATS. This is actually the second time I am openly asking ATS owners... please, please, will you ban me this time?
What I mean is that I have made every imaginable "crime" towards ATS, and I still haven't been banned.
"Third time's a charm", they say. I guess posting here against ATS will certainly get me banned this time.
Or maybe not? I'm very interested to see how this will turn out. Either way, I will have some proofs for my suspicions... whatever happens.
Regarding suspicions, what I am about to do is yet another unforgivable crime - openly posting "private" (no such thing exists on Internet) conversations on ATS. For the purpose of "protecting" the identities of people I conversed with (they are well known to ATS owners, so no real protection exists, either), I will remove all references to them in my quotes (replaced with <xxx>).
So, here we go...
[u2u to me by now banned member...]
Subject: missing threads and posts
from: <banned member>
sent: 8-5-2008 at 09:00 AM
I have had a few threads and posts deleted and banned lately especially when they concern the integrity of ATS.
Only recently on a post ([removed by me]) I posted and had words with <moderator>! All my posts AND <moderator's> posts have disappeared and not one u2u to explain.
These guys have issues I think!
Take a look at this............
This was made at Open Minds Forum
Re: Mars anomalies
« Reply #15 on Jan 9, 2007, 1:08pm »Simon Grey (one of the 3 ATS owners) posted today at RU.
"Of course ATS is a destination for serious discussion, evidence of that can be seen in that we have collaborated with NASA as one example on clarifying confusion surrounding images of Mars."
I wonder what Clark McClelland a retired senior NASA official here would say about ATS' investigative prudence in collaborating with NASA for "clarifying confusion surrounding images of Mars"?
Though this was moved to a private forum I have since learned it is in fact true and that So and Springer post more at RU than they do here in a forum called ATS Watch...
From SO at RU...
Post-banned until we learn more of his intentions direction from him.
Also this from Springer
What do you make of this? Its info I received from another member! Your views would be appreciated.
[my u2u as reply to <banned member>...]
Subject: Re: missing threads and posts
sent: 14-5-2008 at 12:00 PM
I didn't expect to be coming back to ATS, but I've seen something interesting and came back to send a u2u. That's the only reason I was able to see your u2u to me.
Yes, very interesting. I don't see the exact links in your u2u. You probably just copied and pasted the page. Could you copy the links on that page and send them to me?
As I said it in that thread, SkepticOverlord definitely has intention to lull the people into false security. Now, the reason can be as benign as simply wanting to earn more cash from commercials on the site (if you own a site, especially a forum, you definitely want people to come forward and generate more hits; the more people are around, the more cash you get), or it could be something more sinister.
I have no proof of either, but the intention itself if quite enough for me to know who and what I'm dealing with. Nothing good, that's for sure.
On a side note, I noticed a strange behavior of u2u messages... Sometimes they are marked as read even though I haven't read them myself.
I discussed this matter with another member (which, it seems, has been taken to the depths of black projects several weeks ago; by her own wish, I must add; I was just an unexpected middle-man in the process). After that discussion, a complete opposite thing started happening to u2u's. Even after I had read them, and refreshed the page, and logged off and back on, they wouldn't be marked as read...
My guess (from my programming experience) was that in that particular period someone working on the ATS' server code was given instructions to conceal the reading of u2u's by a third party (owners, or high-level moderators). That person had no time to put the real code into place, and he/she just "patched" it, causing the opposite, but still highly suspicious behavior.
When I put all this circumstantial evidence on a pile, what I get is a picture of a well organized forum, with payed programmers working on it (the money has to come from somewhere), but with highly dubious intentions...
To me that smells of ABC agency paying the bills, while the owner is only asked to take care of the "house".
Never mind that house is bugged, just feel comfortable inside. We have such beatuies and wonders around. Feel at ease. Nothing to worry about...
One thing I've learned over time is that I should always assume someone is watching over my back. At first, it can generate a lot of fear, but fear is the first obstacle on the path of man of knowledge (a term from Carlos Castaneda's work; here's the excerpt from the first link I got on Google: http://tantricplanet.com/).
So, you see, even with all the wrong intentions of site owners, ATS was a great place to learn new things. SkepticOverlord turned out to be a very interesting "petty tyrant" and "worthy opponent" (both terms from Castaneda's work).
I thank SkepticOverlord for the oportunity he gave me by deleting that thread (in case he's reading this ).
Other than saying that, I feel no obligation to him, or to any other owner or moderator here [on ATS].
I am only interested in people, not "institutions", whatever they like to call themselves.
As a consequence of me seeing on the following day that this member was banned, I turned to the <moderator> as a source of confirmation or denial of what <banned member> was telling me.
[my u2u to <moderator>...]
Subject: <banned member> banned & u2u's
sent: 15-5-2008 at 07:37 AM
Since the owners of ATS (obviously) still don't have a clue who they are dealing with, and whoever is telling them what to do has (also obviously) told them to take the heat and don't do anything stupid at this time, I am still able to send u2u's.
This may be against privacy matters I usually hold respect for, but you were mentioned in this particular u2u, and the member who sent it to me was banned on the same day he sent it to me. I certainly hope this is not an infectious disease, and that you won't be banned in the same manner, but I can give no guarantees.
[I repeat here <banned member's> u2u to me]
Please, observe that he created this thread 6 days before his u2u to me. Thus, that particular thread was not the reason he was banned. Again, he was banned on the same day I replied to him.
"Something is rotten in the state of Denmark..."
And, here's my reply to <banned memeber>. I really don't know if he had the time to read it, and I would really hate to see it wasted, so I'm sending it to you since you were the only person <banned memeber> mentioned in his u2u.
[I repeat here my reply to <banned memeber>]
Oh, yes... just a little reminder for SkepticOverlord and the "team" behind him.
I expected to be banned, but you didn't do it.
Why? That's the only question I have for you.
I already know the answer, but I would like others to know it as well. Maybe you could send it to <moderator> first, and then distribute it on ATS's front page?
Just kidding... Of course you won't do any such thing... Will you?
Anyway, this time I am leaving not just the public arena of ATS, but also the private one, so please, please.... will you ban me this time?
I mean, how many "rules" do I have to break to be banned here?! It's just ridiculous!
After moderator asked me what I wanted with my u2u, I replied with this...
[my u2u to <moderator>...]
Subject: Re: <banned member> banned & u2u
sent: 15-5-2008 at 08:31 AM
Keep it short and simple though. Im just a Forum Moderator
Confirmation or denial that you discussed the matter of disappearing threads with <banned member>. I believe that's short and simple.
I also fogot to put the link to <banned member's> thread I was referring to. Sorry about that.
[removed by me]
Also, you seem to think I am <banned member> as well. I can assure you that I'm not, but I can't prove it, can I? Neither can you prove that you are not into it all with ATS owners, can you? We are here in the same position after all.
So, confirmation or denial. That's enough.
P.S. for programmers on ATS
Something should really be done about user interface for u2u's. One can hardly see if one missed something. A u2u preview feature would be very nice...
After being given a highly indirect (but still readable) confirmation for <banned member's> claims by this <moderator>, I replied with this...
Subject: Re: <banned member> banned & u2u
sent: 15-5-2008 at 11:01 AM
But suppose ATS is involved in a conspiracy: A conspiracy to do what? To let people post about all sorts of alternative topics?
Oh, no. Not consipracy. Simply a psychological laboratory.
It's useful (at least for the serious agencies out there) having all kinds of different personalities interacting among themselves. Something like mice in a maze. And I very much doubt those "white coats" have any good intentions towards the mice. This is strictly from a "higher perspective" point of view, of course.
But, from an even higher perspective, it's also useful to watch "white coats" experimenting on mice. At some point the "white coats" became mice themselves, and they didn't even see it. Heck, they still don't see it, however hard one tries to open their eyes. What happens to mice will happen to them as well. And very soon, from what I could gather.
Thanks for answering my question. I appreciate it.
I also know it's dangerous to be in the middle of the pyramid structure. Pressures from above, pressures from below. It's not a pleasant place to be.
Best wishes, and take care.
Suffice it to say that <moderator> didn't believe a word I said in my last reply. But, those who have some better information do have some idea about what I'm talking about.
So, you see, I am really conducting an experiment here. Exactly as I have stated. Those with good observational skills will notice (after reading my other posts on ATS) that I have always stated my intentions before bringing them into reality. This is a prerequisite for stalkers (Castaneda's term). Nothing is concealed, but enough mist is left around to not disclose the moves completely in advance. Whoever is smart enough will know exactly what is going to happen, once intention has been openly declared.
I must emphasize here - this is not deception only because it plays on the card of the stupidity of the other side. You tell them exactly what you are going to do, knowing in advance that they will misinterpret it according to their own understanding (which is highly flawed, by the way). So, in essence, you teach them how to think clearly, and not be misguided by false preconceptions they were forced to learn their whole lives.
Now, the really, really interesting thing is that PTB's use the same strategy themselves. They always tell people what they are about to do. Believe it or not! The (willing) stupidity of the people is what allows them to get away with their plans.
Funny how a tool can be turned around against PTB's themselves, ain't it?
How does that saying go...?
"A stick has two ends..."
To conclude... In a nutshell, this post is an experiment performed by a mouse, on the "white coats". Let us see how they respond.
Another saying comes to mind...
"Damned if you do, damned if you don't..."
(ban me from ATS, that is )