The Invasion from Outer Space

[mavn]

Yes and perhaps that is the problem - most scientists are just too comfortable with the laws of physics and have gotten somewhat lazy over the whole thing. I truly do not believe that Einstein was so vain as to think his discoveries could never be improved upon or warped up so to speak. Hopefully it won't take our world to turn upside down (literally) before we realize there is a whole lot more going on than can be summed up in just a few laws of physics. And it seems to me no one really knows why at certain times in the Earth's history that magnetic north and south have switched positions - wouldn"t that be exciting?

[Access Denied]

Well, in my opinion it’s the people sitting around waiting for God or our “space brothers” to save us from ourselves that prove Darwin was right… and quiet possibly provide the answer to Fermi’s paradox.

Fortunately I know of many scientists who aren’t willing to give up that easy…

Now please try to stay on topic.

[You Can Call Me Ray]

Yes and perhaps that is the problem - most scientists are just too comfortable with the laws of physics and have gotten somewhat lazy over the whole thing.

That is a pretty big casting of the slap-in-the-face net, don't you think? I particularly enjoy all the "experts" that have emerged now that we have the internet.... "experts" who love to say why those who spent 4+ years learning real science are wrong (or lazy).... and these experts, if they even have a degree from an accredited institution, usually have degrees in communication, or liberal studies, etc. Yet these same types feel they have a lock on "zero point energy". Heck, most of them have trouble with the simple, Newtonian energy equation and its applications!

Anyone can be an armchair quarterback...
Ray

[ryguy]

LOL...so true Ray. Zero point energy has been used as the basis for countless scams - for example, scam circuits created by people who are lucky if they could even explain the fundamental's of Faraday's law, or for that matter, Ohm's law....never mind the Casimir force...

Yet countless millionaires are stupid enough to throw good money at these people. Heck...maybe we should invent a propulsion system based on "Zero point energy," - between the expertise on this board we'd likely have a number of interested investors. And based on history...we wouldn't even have to produce any verifiable or valid results - they'll give us hundreds of thousands before they realize they've been scammed...and then they'll be too damn embarassed to tell anyone. People...are....so....stupid....

[mavn]

Well, I have never even suggested I was an expert on anything on this board let alone physics however I don't believe it takes a rocket scientist to see that main stream science research is sometimes limited by it's experts not being more open-minded to alternative investigations. And that is just my opinion so please stop getting so.......defensive or we will all be accused of being off topic instead of just me.

[ryguy]

And that is just my opinion so please stop getting so.......defensive or we will all be accused of being off topic instead of just me.

Ouch...good point!

[Access Denied]

Well, I have never even suggested I was an expert on anything on this board let alone physics however I don't believe it takes a rocket scientist to see that main stream science research is sometimes limited by it's experts not being more open-minded to alternative investigations.

That’s what all the crackpots say…

Crank

[paraphrasing]

…it is widely accepted that the true hallmark of the crank is not so much asserting that the Earth is flat as making this assertion in the face of all counterarguments and contrary evidence.

No argument or evidence can ever be sufficient to make a crank abandon his belief.

Virtually universal characteristics of cranks include:

1. Cranks overestimate their own knowledge and ability, and underestimate that of acknowledged experts.
2. Cranks insist that their alleged discoveries are urgently important.
3. Cranks rarely if ever acknowledge any error, no matter how trivial.
4. Cranks love to talk about their own beliefs, often in inappropriate social situations, but they tend to be bad listeners, and often appear to be uninterested in anyone else's experience or opinions.

In addition, many cranks

1. seriously misunderstand the mainstream opinion to which they believe that they are objecting,
2. stress that they have been working out their ideas for many decades, and claim that this fact alone entails that their belief cannot be dismissed as resting upon some simple error,
3. compare themselves with Galileo or Copernicus, implying that the mere unpopularity of some belief is in itself evidence of plausibility,
4. claim that their ideas are being suppressed by secret intelligence organizations, mainstream science, powerful business interests, or other groups which, they allege, are terrified by the possibility of their allegedly revolutionary insights becoming widely known,
5. appear to regard themselves as persons of unique historical importance.

Cranks who contradict some mainstream opinion in some highly technical field, such as mathematics or physics, almost always

1. exhibit a marked lack of technical ability,
2. misunderstand or fail to use standard notation and terminology,
3. ignore fine distinctions which are essential to correctly understanding mainstream belief.

And that is just my opinion so please stop getting so.......defensive or we will all be accused of being off topic instead of just me.

Thank you and please feel free to start a new thread about these “exciting” prospects for Geomagnetic reversal that I presume you’ve been lead to believe will happen in 2012.

Now about this hypothetical alien invasion from outer space…

Anyone???

[you know, since we’re all being so closed-minded]

[mavn]

AD - Why theorize about an invasion from outer space when it obviously would take nothing less than an official report documented by an "alien being" himself and published in a well-known science journal that you could quote in one of your postings to even begin to convince you of anything and that might not even work. In reality, a person needs the intelligence to be able to think outside of himself (for more than a few fleeting moments) in order to truly understand the world around him, scientist or not.

[ryguy]

I'd be convinced by a military or government official standing up publicly (at a very high level) and making a public announcement regarding the fact that the U.S. government is aware of an extraterrestrial presence. I am never convinced by low-level ex-military or ex-government wingnuts who *wanna-believe*, ex-government scientists who are enjoying overwhelming financial investments/profits from the belief systems created by ufology, or fake personas who hide behind anonymous cloak-n-dagger b.s. games to tell their make-believe, imagined, or misunderstood tales of aliens and abductions that they've fabricated in their minds in order to explain their surreal observations of experimental aircraft and other black projects..

-Ry

[You Can Call Me Ray]

In reality, a person needs the intelligence to be able to think outside of himself (for more than a few fleeting moments) in order to truly understand the world around him, scientist or not.

Elitism is a terrible way to orient yourself towards those you disagree with. What makes you think people who strictly adhere to the precepts of the scientific method do not think outside themselves? Just because they do not come to the same conclusions you do, that makes them unable to understand the world around them?

And for the record, I am not being defensive... I am espousing a counterpoint to your claims that begin with "in reality..." or "I don't believe it takes a rocket scientist to see..."

Ray

[longhaircowboy]

Here's one possible means of travel. Hannes Alfven postulated the Plasma Theory of the universe werein electromagnetism not gravity shaped the universe. Maybe some advanced beings have a way to harness that. Not sure how the propulsion would work but might be something to ponder.

[lost_shaman]

I am never convinced by low-level ex-military or ex-government wingnuts who *wanna-believe*, ex-government scientists who are enjoying overwhelming financial investments/profits from the belief systems created by ufology, or fake personas who hide behind anonymous cloak-n-dagger b.s. games to tell their make-believe, imagined, or misunderstood tales of aliens and abductions that they've fabricated in their minds in order to explain their surreal observations of experimental aircraft and other black projects..

-Ry

That's a good start Ryan.

The only step left is to explain the "unknowns" that are not "experimental aircraft" but more likely natural aerial phenomena (UAP). These likely explain ~95% of all sightings deemed unexplainable. These are the sightings that rejuvenate the "UFO Phenomena" year in and year out, simply for no other reason than people truly do see these Phenomena and are genuinely impressed by them.

You might personally find this interesting Ryan, in that there definitely seems to be a cross over between what 'we' today might call 'UFO's' and what people used to describe as "Ghosts" in general.

[ryguy]

You might personally find this interesting Ryan, in that there definitely seems to be a cross over between what 'we' today might call 'UFO's' and what people used to describe as "Ghosts" in general.

NOW you're talking!

Take the issue of "orbs" for example - whether it's orbs in a room or orbs in the sky... In a room, investigators call it a ghost, yet in the sky they call it a UFO. In my opinion, an orb is an orb...no matter where it is.

[longhaircowboy]

Of course an orb is an orb where ever it might be, but I can honestly say that the three sightings I've had in life wouldn't be described as orbs. Although the one night sighting could have been as it was a light in the sky but appeared to be too far away for me to call it an orb. And check this. After I opened my big mouth about Plasma Cosmology I found this

Fusion is routinely produced in current experiments and we are now on the threshold of "burning plasma" experiments that will allow the construction of useful fusion powers plants .

http://www.plasmas.org/fusion-mag.htm seems earthmen are looking for new forms of power. And if you do a search on plasma theory you'll find many links to NASA.

[Mungodave]

Now about this hypothetical alien invasion from outer space…

Anyone???

[you know, since we’re all being so closed-minded]

It is my firm belief that the worlds population would involuntarily become paralysed in the first instance,
closely followed by blindly panicked.

Where does one run when there is no-where to run?

Where does one hide when there is no-where to hide?

What does one do when there is nothing one can do?

Pandemonium.

Cheers, great thread

Mungo


Edit to add: my avatar seems somewhat apt in this discussion