The Greatest Fraud.

A spiritual perspective on phenomenon

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Re: The Greatest Fraud.

Postby RICH-ENGLAND » Tue Oct 11, 2011 11:45 pm

hi guys, just thought id weigh in a little here as ive been looking into religion a little recently for various reasons and have a few serious questions as the whloe premise doesnt make sense to me...

we have this god thats supposed to be omniscient, omnipresent, omnipotent, all loving and all forgiving so heres my questions for now.

if god is all loving and all forgiving then why should we worship him or obey his commandments etc if surely he will forgive us for whatever we do?.

next up we have the noah and moses stories..

god creates us in his image then is apparently unhappy with our behaviour so decides to wipe us out with the great flood and start over, then again hes still unhappy so apparently gives moses the ten commandments on a mountain to spread his word and get us to behave....

now if this god is omniscient, omnipresent, omnipotent and created us in his image then surely he would have known our futures and got it right in the first place...

is this god really that useless that he gets it wrong over and over?.

why does an all powerful god have to rely one man (moses) to spread his word and why would said god need to create something as useless as the ten commandments on stone when surely it would be far more effective for him to just appear to everyone on earth and just say do as your told or else?.

now im not much a god believer but im one that always tries to look at both sides of everything to draw any conclusions, now for all i know there may be some form of god out there so i cant say for definite that there isnt, but in my opinion from what ive read about religion etc if any god exists it certainly isnt the one that the bible or other religions portray.

i think as the op says, religion is man made for control purposes and most stories are taken from misunderstandings and the inability to explain natural phenomena by science like we can today.

if someone where to try and write a bible (or other religious book) now that lets for argument sake put any religious or cult leader dalai llama, the pope, david icke, david koresh, or someone else that has made any religious or cult claims and were to try and use any modern disaster or war stories as backing like hurricane katrina or 9/11 and ist consecutive wars (aghan/iraq) or global warming etc, the book would just get laughed at because we can now explain these things and dont need to attrbute them to gods.

and i do apologise in advance for maybe using bad examples of people in that last paragraph, they were only used as examples to make a point and were not intended to be compared to anyone or to offend in any way whatsoever.

thanks

rich
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Re: The Greatest Fraud.

Postby bewildered » Sun Oct 16, 2011 10:16 am

RICH-ENGLAND wrote:hi guys, just thought id weigh in a little here as ive been looking into religion a little recently for various reasons and have a few serious questions as the whloe premise doesnt make sense to me...

we have this god thats supposed to be omniscient, omnipresent, omnipotent, all loving and all forgiving so heres my questions for now.

if god is all loving and all forgiving then why should we worship him or obey his commandments etc if surely he will forgive us for whatever we do?.

next up we have the noah and moses stories..

god creates us in his image then is apparently unhappy with our behaviour so decides to wipe us out with the great flood and start over, then again hes still unhappy so apparently gives moses the ten commandments on a mountain to spread his word and get us to behave....

now if this god is omniscient, omnipresent, omnipotent and created us in his image then surely he would have known our futures and got it right in the first place...

is this god really that useless that he gets it wrong over and over?.

why does an all powerful god have to rely one man (moses) to spread his word and why would said god need to create something as useless as the ten commandments on stone when surely it would be far more effective for him to just appear to everyone on earth and just say do as your told or else?.

now im not much a god believer but im one that always tries to look at both sides of everything to draw any conclusions, now for all i know there may be some form of god out there so i cant say for definite that there isnt, but in my opinion from what ive read about religion etc if any god exists it certainly isnt the one that the bible or other religions portray.

i think as the op says, religion is man made for control purposes and most stories are taken from misunderstandings and the inability to explain natural phenomena by science like we can today.

if someone where to try and write a bible (or other religious book) now that lets for argument sake put any religious or cult leader dalai llama, the pope, david icke, david koresh, or someone else that has made any religious or cult claims and were to try and use any modern disaster or war stories as backing like hurricane katrina or 9/11 and ist consecutive wars (aghan/iraq) or global warming etc, the book would just get laughed at because we can now explain these things and dont need to attrbute them to gods.

and i do apologise in advance for maybe using bad examples of people in that last paragraph, they were only used as examples to make a point and were not intended to be compared to anyone or to offend in any way whatsoever.

thanks

rich


I myself spent some time delving into the issue of religion, Rich. I approached it as an honest, relatively unbiased believer. I was honest, because I really wanted to experience the truth whatever that truth might be. I was unbiased due to the fact I was never exposed to religion in the household (or otherwise) as a child. My best friend was a 1971 set of Encyclopedia Britannica - an interesting side note being I had quite a bit of exposure to the Queen's English due to reading those volumes cover to cover many times. Imagine my surprise in English class when, asked to spell the word "specter," I spelled it "spectre" and was informed by my teacher that I spelled the word incorrectly. The nerve of the varlet! :wink:

Over the course of several years I learned some important things about the human experience. Far from expanding my ecclesiastical regimen, I found myself schooled in human nature instead. A person's concept of "god" seemed to derive from their own particular mix of experience and environment. I watched as desperately poor people, behind on rent and car payments, give what little cash they had to the offering plate because they were promised by that preacher wearing the expensive suit that god would reward them for their faith. The irony of that particular moment was never lost on me. This man, who dressed in tailored suits, drove a luxury car and lived in nice home bought and paid for by his denomination, did nothing but exercise glibness a few days a week. Oh, certainly he had meetings to attend...funerals to appear at...people to "counsel"...sermons to deliver a few days of the week...but otherwise, what did he actually do for a living? Nothing, save "fleecing the sheep."

Afterward I learned something far more ominous and appalling...as if the above wasn't bad enough. This man, being the senior pastor of his denominational church, was paid a salary according to the size of his congregation. Taking the numbers and doing a little math, I figured out that this man made in excess of $98,000 a year. In other words, this man who in reality is nothing but a parasite and a leech, makes his living off desperately poor couples just like those I mentioned above.

The more I became involved with the inner circle of this church, the more I learned about the key players themselves...those who comprised the boards, committees, and who presented the face of the church to an entirely too gullible public. There was infighting, backstabbing, adultery...in other words, things you would find anywhere amongst any group of humans. They would do this, then turn around and preach about holiness and God's commands to us all. Mm-hm. :roll:

To make a very long story short, I found this to be universal as I did not limit my searching to one particular brand of religion. People everywhere act like people do, and religion is no exception. A perusal of statistics in the U.S. alone reveals that divorce rates, domestic violence, teenage pregnancy, and other problems are just as prevalent in the "professing population" as they are amongst any other slice of America. When your mind turns to the examples history offers, you see the true purpose religion has served: control. There's nothing quite like letting someone or something else do your thinking for you, yes? It's a pitfall of human nature, which illuminates the last great pillar of truth I discovered: the gods of these religions are only as fallible as their creators. Their god has so many shortcomings because they themselves invented it.

I like this quote from Jon Stewart: "Religion: It offers hope to people in a world torn apart by religion." :shock:
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